62. Little p’s (re-release) - The Power of Small Experiments
“Maybe the answer isn’t to figure out exactly what comes next. Maybe it’s to try something small.”
As we continue to revisit some earlier episodes of Messy Middlescence this summer, we're bringing back an episode from Season #2 called "Little P's." It explores an idea that seems to keep showing up for us: maybe we don't need to figure out one big Purpose for our lives. Maybe we need to pay closer attention to the smaller things that interest us, bring us joy and are curious about.
Tara is currently reading Range by David Epstein, which explores the value of experimenting, trying different things and bringing knowledge and ideas from one area into another. It feels especially relevant today, when there is so much pressure to specialize early and become increasingly good at one particular thing. We encourage our kids to choose their sports, majors and careers, while as adults we can become increasingly comfortable just staying with what we already know and do well.
What if, instead, we allowed ourselves to experiment? Particularly during middlescence, when so much in our lives may already be changing, perhaps we don't need to have everything figured out before deciding what comes next. We can try small things, notice what gives us energy and joy, and use that information to guide us. Think of them as little life experiments.
In the original episode, Tara and Tina discuss a podcast episode from The Happiness Lab with Dr. Laurie Santos about finding purpose. One of their biggest takeaways was the distinction between finding one big Purpose with a capital P and discovering the many little p purposes that can give our lives more meaning and joy.
Finding one big purpose can feel daunting and overwhelming. Instead, what if we paid attention to the things we enjoy doing, the things that make us lose track of time, or even the things we loved when we were younger? Our little p's don't have to change the world, become a career or make us money. They can simply be things that make our lives richer and more enjoyable.
In this episode, Tara and Tina discuss:
letting go of the pressure to discover one singular purpose;
paying attention to the activities, interests and people that fill us up rather than drain us;
looking back at childhood interests for clues about what might still bring us joy;
using the "spaghetti method" — trying different things and seeing what sticks;
giving ourselves, and our children, permission to explore rather than specialize too quickly;
finding ways to make room for our little p's even when work and other responsibilities consume much of our time.
Perhaps most importantly, we don't have to know where an interest will lead before we pursue it. We can take a class, try a new hobby, pick up the instrument, meet someone new or follow something simply because we're curious.
And then pay attention.
Did you enjoy it? Did it give you energy? Do you want to do it again?
Sometimes the best way to figure out what we want isn't to think about it more. It's to try something and see what happens.
What little life experiment(s) would you like to try?
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[00:21] Tara Bansal: As Tina and I take a short break from messy middle lessons this summer, we're revisiting a few episodes from earlier seasons,
[00:29] and this one called Little Peas, is an episode I've been thinking about a lot lately.
[00:35] I'm currently reading Range by David Epstein, and one of the ideas I keep coming back to is the importance of experimenting,
[00:44] trying different things,
[00:46] exploring new interests, and bringing ideas from one part of our lives into another.
[00:52] And maybe because it's on my mind, I seem to be hearing this message everywhere.
[00:58] We currently live in a world that pushes us towards specialization.
[01:02] We encourage kids to choose a sport and get serious about it. Earlier and earlier,
[01:08] we ask young people what they want to major in and what they're going to do with their lives.
[01:13] And as adults, once we've spent decades becoming good at something,
[01:17] it can be even harder to step outside of what we already know and what we're known for.
[01:24] Yet in a world that's changing so quickly, staying within what we already know can be limiting.
[01:31] What if we gave ourselves permission to experiment instead?
[01:36] That's what brought me back to this episode,
[01:38] and it's something that I feel like in multiple episodes we have presented and discussed.
[01:46] When Tina and I originally recorded Little Peasants, we were talking about letting go of the pressure to find one big purpose and instead paying attention to the smaller things that interest us,
[01:59] bring us joy,
[02:01] or make us lose track of time.
[02:03] Listening to this episode again, I hear something else in it, too.
[02:07] An invitation to be curious.
[02:10] We don't necessarily know what's going to bring us joy until we actually try it.
[02:15] We don't know which interests might lead somewhere unexpected,
[02:19] which new person might open a door,
[02:22] or which seemingly unrelated experience might become important later.
[02:27] We can't always think or reason our way into figuring out what we want.
[02:33] Sometimes we have to take action and experiment to get better information about what brings us joy and where we might want to go next.
[02:42] And I think that's especially powerful during middle lessons.
[02:46] We have the advantage of knowing ourselves better than we did when we were in our 20s.
[02:50] But we can also be more comfortable staying with what we know and what we're already good at.
[02:58] Maybe the answer isn't to figure out exactly what comes next.
[03:02] Maybe it's just to try something small.
[03:05] Take the class,
[03:06] pick up the instrument,
[03:08] volunteer somewhere new,
[03:10] try the hobby you've always wondered about.
[03:14] Follow something simply because you're curious about it, and then pay attention.
[03:19] Did you enjoy it?
[03:21] Did it give you energy?
[03:23] Do you want to do it again?
[03:25] Think of all these as little life Experiments.
[03:28] You don't have to know where they're leading.
[03:30] You don't even have to be good at them.
[03:33] You just have to be willing to try.
[03:36] So here's our conversation about finding and making room for your own little peas in your life.
[03:43] Tara Bansal: Hello. Hello. This is Tara Conti Bantzel, and I'm here with my sister, Christina Conti Donovan.
[03:50] And today is just the two of us talking about a podcast that we recommended in the episode with Dr. Alexa Dare.
[04:04] And it was how to find your purpose from the Happiness Lab with Dr. Laurie Santos.
[04:12] Tina and I both listened to this and I just thought it, we both thought it was worth having a discussion.
[04:21] What's interesting to me is I have a good friend who she even told me from listening to the messy middlescence,
[04:31] she's like, you put so much pressure on yourself to come up with a purpose.
[04:37] And that's a big part of.
[04:41] I feel like I've written about it and this episode talks about purpose.
[04:48] And they, they were going to talk about two kind of forms of purpose, purpose with a capital P and little P, purpose.
[04:56] But when you say purpose,
[04:58] it brings this pressure and heaviness and kind of even anxiety of like, what is my purpose? Why should I be here? What's, you know, what's the meaning of my life?
[05:13] And the. I feel like that one of the biggest takeaways from this podcast that we are referring to was to let go of that. And there isn't just one big purpose.
[05:29] And even those that often go after and feel like they know what their big purpose is, it's often goal oriented.
[05:38] And then once they achieve it,
[05:40] they don't have that satisfaction that they expected once they did achieve it.
[05:46] The podcast refers to a book called the Purpose Code.
[05:51] I have not read the book.
[05:53] This is just Tina and my thoughts both from listening to the podcast.
[05:58] Tina, what was something that stood out to you?
[06:02] Christina Donovan: That. Yeah, I mean, it's something that you brought up in the introduction. But this idea of purpose having a little pee.
[06:11] And I fully agree with everything you said. Just people say think of purpose and it becomes this, oh, I have to find a meaning in my life. And they do a really good job talking about how you don't have to save the world.
[06:29] And this idea of a little P in purpose I found reassuring and accessible. And I think a lot easier to think about than purpose with a capital P.
[06:45] I agree.
[06:47] Tara Bansal: Something that stood out to me,
[06:49] and part of this is my life coaching,
[06:52] is that culturally we were often influenced not just by social media, but by Our parents by.
[07:06] By just culture of.
[07:09] For what we should with a capital S be doing and the responsibility for that.
[07:18] And the.
[07:20] The author talks about how he. He was a doctor,
[07:24] and he took that on,
[07:27] you know,
[07:29] because his father died, who was a doctor, and he thought that was going to provide meaning.
[07:36] I just keep going to. And I'm. I'm hearing it in multiple places of,
[07:43] like, listening to ourselves.
[07:45] And Martha Beck, who I just went through her life coach training, the essential self versus your social self.
[07:55] And so the social self teaches you these cultural norms and expectations,
[08:01] and your essential self may not always agree with or be in alignment with the social self.
[08:11] And that was what stood out to me, the little P. Purpose.
[08:17] He talks about just following and doing the things that bring you joy or that interest you.
[08:25] And instead of.
[08:28] I feel like the. The things you think you should be doing,
[08:32] and even the should is like having this one big thing instead of, like,
[08:38] lots of little things that you enjoy.
[08:41] Am I making any sense, Tina?
[08:42] Christina Donovan: No, I think definitely when I finished listening,
[08:48] that was the one question. I was sort of like, oh, they talk about purpose with a little P. But,
[08:53] you know, this idea that why can't you have more than one purpose?
[08:59] They definitely keep talking about purpose in a singular sense. And I walked away from that being like, oh, like, even if it's a little P, it's still one. Whereas I think it's more realistic that maybe you have multiple little purposes in your life.
[09:15] And when you talk about them as being joys, I think that makes a lot more sense,
[09:21] because even the way
[09:22] Tara Bansal: he described it, I felt like
[09:27] Tara Bansal: he
[09:28] Tara Bansal: does palliative care,
[09:30] he does blogging, he does a podcast. He does,
[09:35] you know,
[09:36] multiple different things.
[09:38] And I don't know, part of me was thinking, like, this podcast in itself for me is a little P. Like, we're not doing this expecting to make a lot of money or,
[09:53] you know, like, with a financial goal or anything like that.
[10:00] But I honestly look forward to and thoroughly have enjoyed the interviews and what I've learned and getting to have these conversations with you, Tina, and with the other people on the show,
[10:14] what comes to mind for you as some of your little peas?
[10:19] Christina Donovan: Yeah, it's interesting.
[10:21] They give tips on finding how to find your purpose or your little pea. And,
[10:28] you know, one of the things that he talks about is to look back on your childhood and think about the things that you enjoyed doing as a child.
[10:41] And they're pretty upfront. That was one of the things I liked about them, is they said not all of these Tips are going to work for you. And, you know, some people say there wasn't anything in my childhood that stands out that I still want to do, and then there's another tip for those people.
[10:56] But,
[10:57] yeah, I mean, definitely for me,
[11:00] you know, working with plants and flowers and being outside is something that I remember from a young age, just always being interested in.
[11:14] And,
[11:15] I mean, it's definitely something I'm lucky enough to be able to fill my life with because I have time.
[11:23] But I think no matter what, that's always going to be a piece of my life. That is a little P.
[11:30] You know, I can't say what it is, but caring for plants just brings me joy.
[11:37] Tara Bansal: When I.
[11:38] One of the things I was thinking for you,
[11:41] and you could tell me where I'm wrong, but, like,
[11:45] I just see us in our house in Hudson,
[11:50] and you.
[11:51] You were so into music,
[11:56] and, like,
[11:57] I feel like you introduced me to all the great bands.
[12:01] Christina Donovan: I never really realized that. Yeah, I mean, music, too. Although I think that's the thing. It's a little. For me, it's. Music is a little intimidating in my family because I have.
[12:13] I'm surrounded by a lot of musicians. I mean, I have talented children, and my husband is a talented musician. So I guess it's made me view the way music is a part of my life in a different way, because I'm not a participant.
[12:29] I'm more of a listener, you know, enjoyer. Enjoyer. Yeah.
[12:36] Whereas for some people in my household, music is something they do in terms of creation,
[12:44] you know, Creating. Creating.
[12:46] So it's a little different from that.
[12:49] Tara Bansal: But did. I mean, you played so many instruments? Like.
[12:54] Christina Donovan: Yeah, but you can play a lot of instruments and not have.
[12:59] I don't know. It's also, I guess, interesting, too. I mean, the way I approach music and the way I watch my husband and my children approach music is very different.
[13:10] Um, in terms of.
[13:12] Yeah. How they listen and.
[13:14] Tara Bansal: Yeah,
[13:15] but that was just something that stood out. When I think of your childhood,
[13:20] and you were more, you know, like, more teenager. Teenager. But how much you enjoyed music,
[13:29] and we're so cutting edge and.
[13:32] Christina Donovan: Yeah, I wouldn't say that, but. Oh, I feel like. I don't know, what are some of your little P's?
[13:38] Tara Bansal: I mean,
[13:39] I've started asking people what.
[13:43] What they enjoyed and what they did in their childhood, including,
[13:47] like, my own kids, like, what is it that you really love to do?
[13:52] The one thing that stood out to me was I used to do collages where I would cut out, you know, like words or pictures and.
[14:05] And usually it was words, but I would spend hours, like, getting them all to fit together.
[14:11] So, like, every millimeter of the page was covered with these words that I liked and created something.
[14:19] It definitely wasn't like, a beautiful work of art, but. But I enjoyed doing that. And I.
[14:26] I don't know. I don't know what that.
[14:27] Christina Donovan: You know, I remember you doing that, but.
[14:30] Tara Bansal: Yeah.
[14:30] Christina Donovan: I mean, even just hearing you describe it, it sounds like you would lose track of time.
[14:34] Tara Bansal: Yeah.
[14:35] Christina Donovan: Doing that. And that's, you know, that's one of the things they talk about as a child is when you immerse yourself in something and you're enjoying it so much, you lose a sense of time and.
[14:46] Yeah.
[14:47] What are activities that do that for you now? You know, try to recreate that.
[14:53] Tara Bansal: And I think for me,
[14:56] a little bit of a takeaway is to do some more creative things without any expectation of, like,
[15:09] a result of, like, having something to, like, even show for it, but just to enjoy the process.
[15:17] I just know for me, I get the critical voice.
[15:21] This is so not good. Why are you even bothering? You know, But I think to go back to more creativity and play with that as a little pea if I had time.
[15:35] Yeah.
[15:36] I mean, another little P. For me is just singing. I'm a terrible singer.
[15:43] Christina Donovan: And yet we have friends here that are professional singers, and I remember they teach too private lessons. And I remember asking them once, like, you know, can you pretty much teach anybody to sing, you know,
[15:58] no matter how bad they are, and. And they are convinced that you can sing even if you think you can't. That proper instruction and time that you can become a reasonable singer.
[16:11] So maybe that's something you should.
[16:13] Tara Bansal: It is.
[16:14] Christina Donovan: It's on my list. And to do some voice lessons. And it might not be.
[16:21] Yeah. As difficult as you think,
[16:24] but that's how. And then I think once you have some confidence, you can join a choir or, you know, you can kind of do some things maybe that are.
[16:33] Tara Bansal: But even that. Like just singing in the car by myself.
[16:38] Christina Donovan: Yeah.
[16:38] Tara Bansal: Trying to think of other. I mean. And that's the podcast talks about.
[16:43] And I love how they gave multiple options of trying to explore and figure out what.
[16:52] You know, if you don't have anything that jumps out from your childhood, then it's.
[16:57] Christina Donovan: Yeah. They call it spaghetti method.
[16:59] Tara Bansal: So just start trying things. Trying multiple things. Anything that interests you or you think could possibly interest you. Give it a try and see what happens.
[17:11] Christina Donovan: And if it doesn't, walk away. I mean,
[17:14] I know that.
[17:15] I mean, One of the other things that stood out to me, and this is just as a parent,
[17:20] and they talk about how children take on things they think they should do because of their parents. And it is hard. I mean,
[17:31] you want your children to find their own path, but you also want them to be able to financially support themselves.
[17:41] And sometimes they struggle to find what that path is. And I don't know, I think that it was a good reminder that to kind of give your children the time and space to find out what they want to do and maybe only assist them when you really feel like they
[18:05] Tara Bansal: need it to that point. I agree. I think we're asked to specialize so early and I think that's a shame, you know, like even both academically and sports and everything.
[18:23] But I just wish we all could experiment and feel comfortable trying more and different things.
[18:34] I mean, if you find something you love, that's great,
[18:37] but I just do feel like there's this pressure of.
[18:42] Christina Donovan: Yeah, I mean, when you talked about sort of that social pressure, I think that's there. I mean, you know, you as a parent of two high school graduates and almost two college graduates, you know, you hear what other people's kids are doing and you hear about, you know,
[19:00] it's hard not to sometimes feel like, oh, like my kid doesn't have a, you know, a high powered,
[19:07] high salary job,
[19:09] you know, coming out of college, or,
[19:12] you know, my child doesn't want to do this or doesn't want to do that. And it's, it is,
[19:17] it's hard sometimes to just kind of be like, nope, that's not their path, you know,
[19:22] and to not worry, I guess, or feel like they're doing something wrong because they're doing something different. Maybe.
[19:33] Tara Bansal: No.
[19:33] Tara Bansal: And. And I think that is important to.
[19:36] Sometimes it's hard to distinguish why we're doing things or you don't see the filter because it's there. And I feel like socially we're all in that water that you almost don't notice the water.
[19:53] Right. And I feel like the other to me is there's often a go after what you're good at. And so that was for me. I went into math and science because I was good at it.
[20:08] But I wish I hadn't. I shouldn't say that. I mean, like, I just feel like my essential self doesn't find joy in that. Love engineering. Right. Like, and it took me a while to kind of listen to myself.
[20:24] And that's part of what I feel like I'm trying to do. And I want this podcast to encourage other people to do.
[20:32] There's a.
[20:34] A coaching exercise. I can't remember if we've talked about it,
[20:38] but.
[20:39] And it relates to the podcast,
[20:44] you know,
[20:46] in. He called it embrace the art of subtraction.
[20:50] But the exercise is like, keep track of the things and even the people that fill you up and those things that you procrastinate on you, dread you like, you know, and even people that drain you.
[21:08] And so he talks about doing more of the things that fill you up and how can you delegate,
[21:17] get rid of or make choices that decrease the other things that you don't like? Right. Like,
[21:25] I don't know. And it sounds pretty simple, but I feel like you can always keep doing that for fine tuning.
[21:33] And there's lots of things we think we can't get rid of or we should be doing.
[21:41] And you can, if you really, you know, are creative and think about it. What's your reaction to that, Tina?
[21:50] Christina Donovan: Yeah, I mean, I think one of the things that I found helpful in this podcast was they were pretty clear that this is not for people of privilege or people of a certain amount of money that have the freedom that, you know, this is very much.
[22:12] These are exercises anybody can do. And if you take the time to do it and don't expect overnight or in a couple months success, that it's something that might take years to accomplish and,
[22:29] you know, to sort of be patient and be creative and to work through it. I don't know. I thought that was one of the things that I was happy to hear.
[22:40] Tara Bansal: He said it took him four years from basically deciding he did not want to be a doctor until he was able to really step away from that. And that's the other is he talks about trying to do things at the margins, like at no matter what your job is,
[23:00] talk to the people around you. Of this part, I like this part. I don't. How can,
[23:05] you know, I do more?
[23:06] Christina Donovan: How can I do more and less of this? Yeah,
[23:09] I was impressed with just sort of how comprehensive it was while still kind of just not being too nitty gritty. Yeah.
[23:20] Tara Bansal: I just thought it was really practical.
[23:25] Christina Donovan: Yeah.
[23:26] Tara Bansal: In recommendations they had and how to. And it was well organized, too.
[23:33] Christina Donovan: I mean, the one thing they talked about, a life review,
[23:36] he is a hospice. Hospice, I was gonna say. Yeah, he is a hospice doctor. And he talked about one of the things they do with patients is this life review, which is a series of questions.
[23:49] I wish they actually had spent more time.
[23:52] He mentions a few of the questions,
[23:55] but I'd Almost like to see.
[23:58] Tara Bansal: Yeah.
[23:58] Tara Bansal: What is the.
[23:59] Christina Donovan: I had 10 same reactions,
[24:01] five questions. Because he does talk about how he doesn't understand why a life review isn't done before your deathbed. That this is something people. It's a tool that people could be doing throughout their lives to make sure,
[24:15] you know, when they get to their deathbed, that they're in a good place. And so, yeah, that was the one thing that I wish they had either published or talked more about.
[24:27] And I guess maybe we could research and see maybe it is out there. But that was one of the things that.
[24:33] Tara Bansal: And maybe it's in the book. I don't know.
[24:35] Tara Bansal: Like.
[24:36] Tara Bansal: But I had the exact same reaction of, like,
[24:39] I want a copy of the Life review.
[24:42] What are some of the questions? And it talks about,
[24:46] you know,
[24:47] looking at regrets or things you wish. And to me, that's,
[24:54] you know, so then with that information,
[24:56] what can you do now?
[24:59] Right. To, like, either start pursuing it or making changes,
[25:03] even at the margins, you know, of. Of that.
[25:08] It was interesting. I will put this in the show notes, but I listened to just kind of by chance, 10% happier with Dan Harris, and he had an episode with Jonathan Fields.
[25:22] I can't remember the title of it, but it was very much also about finding your spark and what lights you up.
[25:33] And a big part of that was also,
[25:39] it's not just for people with money and privilege that anyone can and should be doing this to find joy in their life.
[25:49] And he has a quiz or a test online.
[25:56] I think it's like, find your sparkology or something.
[26:00] And it's supposed to help, you know better what those sparks have. Yeah. Those sparks or what, really.
[26:10] And I haven't taken the test, but I definitely want to. And we'll include that because I'm just interested to see what it says and what new information.
[26:19] Christina Donovan: Yeah, I'm interested, too.
[26:21] Tara Bansal: Most people said they just felt like it was reaffirming or confirming almost, like,
[26:27] Christina Donovan: things what they already knew.
[26:29] Tara Bansal: Yeah.
[26:29] Christina Donovan: But then. Yeah.
[26:31] Tara Bansal: To have it more in black and white, which is how I think of the strengths finder.
[26:38] Like, you take this test and it tells you what your top five strengths are.
[26:43] And when you hear them, it just, like, gave almost like a label to something that I know about myself, but made it more concrete and more clear.
[26:54] Christina Donovan: Yeah. And gave you the vocabulary to talk about it. Yeah.
[26:59] Tara Bansal: And language. Yeah. Around it. Well, anything else that you.
[27:06] Christina Donovan: No, just. It's definitely worth a listen and I think, hopefully people will give it a try. I think it's. It's definitely. It's not long. It's what?
[27:22] Tara Bansal: Yeah, it's less than an hour. And I, I love the message. I thought it was.
[27:30] Christina Donovan: Yeah.
[27:31] Tara Bansal: Of value. You know, it talks about that your,
[27:35] Your little. And I want to keep going back to that. Like your little p. Purposes are yours alone instead of the expectations that are set all around you.
[27:48] Tina, I remember you. Me,
[27:51] I think it was.
[27:53] I don't know if it was you, me and Cindy and even if Amy was in the car,
[27:57] but we were talking about,
[27:59] like,
[28:00] what we would do,
[28:02] what we would love to do if we could do anything.
[28:06] Do you remember this conversation? And then we went to, like, then when you have to do it for money,
[28:11] it kind of ruins it.
[28:13] And the more I. Because I keep going back to that, like, wondering if that is true. Like people who love to cook,
[28:22] but then when suddenly they have to do it to get a paycheck. And I think this is very true of artists that they love doing art,
[28:32] but they don't want to be told,
[28:35] like, this is what you need to produce. And with deadlines and expectations that. That can just bring the joy out of it. Yeah,
[28:46] take all the joy out of it.
[28:48] And,
[28:50] and that he talks about,
[28:52] you know, your little Pete purposes should feel abundant.
[28:57] And,
[28:58] And I guess a couple of things is maybe your little p. Purposes aren't going to be what help you pay the bills, but still how you can include them and find time for them in your life.
[29:14] I don't know.
[29:15] I just always think of how Cindy was saying, like, once you have to do something for money, it can very much change the joy and the freedom
[29:27] Christina Donovan: of it that it brings you. Yeah.
[29:30] Tara Bansal: Yeah.
[29:31] Christina Donovan: And so, I mean, I know we're wrapping up, but that is one of the things I feel like is difficult in our society today is
[29:43] Tara Bansal: the way
[29:44] Christina Donovan: most jobs are now. I mean,
[29:47] if you make enough money that you can only work one job,
[29:53] the job is so all consumer encompassing. I mean, you know, people work all the time, especially with our devices. You know, you're working even when you're not supposed to. You, you end up working email later, you end up working on the weekends, it's hard to take vacations.
[30:11] And you know, if you're not in a job that pays that well, then you're probably working more than one job. Like, I know, like teachers often have like a side gig.
[30:21] And I think one of the things that has happened, you know, you look back in the 50s and 60s, you know, people worked 9 to 5,
[30:30] they didn't have commutes and they had a lot more time in their life to pursue other things, whether it was being with other people or hobbies or recreation. And I do feel like that is something that is really missing from our.
[30:48] The way our society now is structured with the financial obligations and the way people work.
[30:56] And that's not true for everyone, but I do think it's made it more difficult to just have some little P's in your life in addition to your, you know, your job.
[31:06] Yeah.
[31:07] Tara Bansal: And part of my reaction to that
[31:09] Tara Bansal: is
[31:12] Tara Bansal: almost you have to, like, fight against it or like, really create your boundaries or how to be intentional on,
[31:21] you know, protecting some time for your little peas and how to go about that. I mean,
[31:28] he talked about that.
[31:30] I don't know what study it was, but it said most people have five hours per day to do other things besides work.
[31:40] And I'm sure many of us don't feel like we have five hours.
[31:44] But a little bit of it is to notice where and how you are spending your time and where can you make the time to do more of the things you love.
[31:56] And I. I mean,
[31:58] I'll just end with this that he talks about. Just get started.
[32:03] So a little bit, and then you can build momentum as you discover more or you find more joy,
[32:10] then hopefully you will do more and you can find a community that of other people who enjoy that and do that.
[32:21] And that's a big part of this also is just relationships and connections.
[32:27] But I truly believe we're.
[32:31] I don't know, God wants us to enjoy our life and so our.
[32:36] How can we do that?
[32:38] And that's what I'm working on is like, how to do more of the things I love and less of the things I don't.
[32:45] So that. That's like. I feel like the whole message of that podcast, which,
[32:51] yeah, is once again, thank you for listening and till next time, we hope you're doing great.
[33:00] Tara Bansal: Today's recommendation is a little redundant, but
[33:04] Tara Bansal: our recommendation is to listen to the podcast the Happiness Lab with Dr. Laurie Santos and this episode,
[33:12] how to find you'd purpose with Dr. Jordan Grummett.
[33:16] That podcast is what we discussed in this episode and is based on Dr. Jordan Grummett's book, the purpose,
[33:27] how to unlock meaning, maximize happiness,
[33:30] and leave a lasting legacy.
[33:33] All things we are all about here at Messy Middlescence.
[33:38] Have a great day.
[33:39] Christina Donovan: For show notes and other information about our podcast, please Visit our website,
[33:44] messymiddalescence.com if you enjoyed listening, please help spread the word about our podcast by sending a link to a family member or friend and don't forget to leave a positive rating or review for us.
[33:58] As always, we hope you will return for more.
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Range: Why Generalists Triumph in a Specialized World by David Epstein
The Happiness Lab with Dr. Laurie Santos Episode - “How to Find Your Purpose” with Jordan Grumet, MD
The Purpose Code: How to Unlock Meaning, Maximize Happiness, and Leave a Lasting Legacy by Jordan Grumet, MD
10% Happier Podcast with Dan Harris Episode 923 - “Are you Spending Your Life on Things You Actually Enjoy and Care About?” with Jonathan Fields
StrengthsFinder is now called Clifton Strengths
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